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Err... Yatagaryu ?
#1
Heya, competitive players !

I really don't know how to say it (cuz i'm pretty tired  sorry for that ^^), but i've noticed there is no thread about Yatagaryu, wich i think have a great potential in competition ^^

So, if anybody project to create one someday, i'd be glad to read it and comment it !

And if anybody project to create one someday, well, do it ! JUST DO IT ! -breathes intensly-

(As i said before, i'm really tired, so if it's near to incomprehensible, that's normal, don't worry... I suppose !)
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#2
(10-21-2016, 12:09 AM)Akexus Wrote: Heya, competitive players !

I really don't know how to say it (cuz i'm pretty tired  sorry for that ^^), but i've noticed there is no thread about Yatagaryu, wich i think have a great potential in competition ^^

So, if anybody project to create one someday, i'd be glad to read it and comment it !

And if anybody project to create one someday, well, do it ! JUST DO IT ! -breathes intensly-

(As i said before, i'm really tired, so if it's near to incomprehensible, that's normal, don't worry... I suppose !)
Most of the analysis  writers here have been holding back on the analyses for the time being because some pokemon are going to be going through radical changes in the future iirc.  Whether through buffs or nerfs to the pokemon themselves, or just changes in their movelists such as different power/accuracy for specific moves and access to egg moves.

Take Raffiti for example.  The 1.0.4 update nerfed Expunge heavily.  It's now a 110 power move with 70% accuracy.  Yes, it does have perfect accuracy in Fallout, but Raffiti will get mauled by Fallout, and the only pokemon that can set up the weather currently are the super niche Urayne and Xenoqueen, and only for 5 turns.  Raffiti's not doing any reliable Expunge sweeping any more.

I personally have an Archiles analysis that's basically ready to go despite that (we know Archilles's egg moves already, so that helps), but the 2 other writers I sent it to for review have yet to get back to me on it, strangely enough.  I might have to send them a reminder at this rate...

I'm sure someone will get around to doing Yatagaryu eventually.  Of course, we need to start posting the other analyses again too...
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#3
(10-21-2016, 05:22 AM)Dragonstrike Wrote:
(10-21-2016, 12:09 AM)Akexus Wrote: Heya, competitive players !

I really don't know how to say it (cuz i'm pretty tired  sorry for that ^^), but i've noticed there is no thread about Yatagaryu, wich i think have a great potential in competition ^^

So, if anybody project to create one someday, i'd be glad to read it and comment it !

And if anybody project to create one someday, well, do it ! JUST DO IT ! -breathes intensly-

(As i said before, i'm really tired, so if it's near to incomprehensible, that's normal, don't worry... I suppose !)
Most of the analysis  writers here have been holding back on the analyses for the time being because some pokemon are going to be going through radical changes in the future iirc.  Whether through buffs or nerfs to the pokemon themselves, or just changes in their movelists such as different power/accuracy for specific moves and access to egg moves.

Take Raffiti for example.  The 1.0.4 update nerfed Expunge heavily.  It's now a 110 power move with 70% accuracy.  Yes, it does have perfect accuracy in Fallout, but Raffiti will get mauled by Fallout, and the only pokemon that can set up the weather currently are the super niche Urayne and Xenoqueen, and only for 5 turns.  Raffiti's not doing any reliable Expunge sweeping any more.

I personally have an Archiles analysis that's basically ready to go despite that (we know Archilles's egg moves already, so that helps), but the 2 other writers I sent it to for review have yet to get back to me on it, strangely enough.  I might have to send them a reminder at this rate...

I'm sure someone will get around to doing Yatagaryu eventually.  Of course, we need to start posting the other analyses again too...

Thanks for the answer !
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#4
(10-21-2016, 05:22 AM)Dragonstrike Wrote:
(10-21-2016, 12:09 AM)Akexus Wrote: Heya, competitive players !

I really don't know how to say it (cuz i'm pretty tired  sorry for that ^^), but i've noticed there is no thread about Yatagaryu, wich i think have a great potential in competition ^^

So, if anybody project to create one someday, i'd be glad to read it and comment it !

And if anybody project to create one someday, well, do it ! JUST DO IT ! -breathes intensly-

(As i said before, i'm really tired, so if it's near to incomprehensible, that's normal, don't worry... I suppose !)
Most of the analysis  writers here have been holding back on the analyses for the time being because some pokemon are going to be going through radical changes in the future iirc.  Whether through buffs or nerfs to the pokemon themselves, or just changes in their movelists such as different power/accuracy for specific moves and access to egg moves.

Take Raffiti for example.  The 1.0.4 update nerfed Expunge heavily.  It's now a 110 power move with 70% accuracy.  Yes, it does have perfect accuracy in Fallout, but Raffiti will get mauled by Fallout, and the only pokemon that can set up the weather currently are the super niche Urayne and Xenoqueen, and only for 5 turns.  Raffiti's not doing any reliable Expunge sweeping any more.

I personally have an Archiles analysis that's basically ready to go despite that (we know Archilles's egg moves already, so that helps), but the 2 other writers I sent it to for review have yet to get back to me on it, strangely enough.  I might have to send them a reminder at this rate...

I'm sure someone will get around to doing Yatagaryu eventually.  Of course, we need to start posting the other analyses again too...
I got your analysis, Dragon ,its just that I've been busy and distracted by my life to have anytime to right up a detailed review of it. From what I remember, you did a wonderful job on it, and I could not spot any glaring grammatical errors (unlike my own). I am thinking about writing up an Anaylsis on the Pure Steel type Pokémon along with Winotinger, since I have good ideas for both right now. Whoever does Yat. has to keep in mind that what ever set it uses, it will probably end up in Ubers at the rate it is going....

Oh, and while Expunge has been nerf, it can still Sketch Atomic Slash or, if you tricky enough, Uranye unobtainable move Atomic Punch. It can also do tons of things with Baton Passing or Status, and Fire Blast+Earthquake eats everything alive regaurdless. Its still a thread, just one that has to be planned a little more differently.
Like the wind, I come and go as I please... but I am always there to provide a comforting breeze.

Member of Team PUNishment. Pun-pare for Struggle, make it Double Team!

Heart Phantom is my OTP~ Heart

Online ID: 000650
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#5
(10-21-2016, 11:43 AM)Lord Windos Wrote:
(10-21-2016, 05:22 AM)Dragonstrike Wrote:
(10-21-2016, 12:09 AM)Akexus Wrote: Heya, competitive players !

I really don't know how to say it (cuz i'm pretty tired  sorry for that ^^), but i've noticed there is no thread about Yatagaryu, wich i think have a great potential in competition ^^

So, if anybody project to create one someday, i'd be glad to read it and comment it !

And if anybody project to create one someday, well, do it ! JUST DO IT ! -breathes intensly-

(As i said before, i'm really tired, so if it's near to incomprehensible, that's normal, don't worry... I suppose !)
Most of the analysis  writers here have been holding back on the analyses for the time being because some pokemon are going to be going through radical changes in the future iirc.  Whether through buffs or nerfs to the pokemon themselves, or just changes in their movelists such as different power/accuracy for specific moves and access to egg moves.

Take Raffiti for example.  The 1.0.4 update nerfed Expunge heavily.  It's now a 110 power move with 70% accuracy.  Yes, it does have perfect accuracy in Fallout, but Raffiti will get mauled by Fallout, and the only pokemon that can set up the weather currently are the super niche Urayne and Xenoqueen, and only for 5 turns.  Raffiti's not doing any reliable Expunge sweeping any more.

I personally have an Archiles analysis that's basically ready to go despite that (we know Archilles's egg moves already, so that helps), but the 2 other writers I sent it to for review have yet to get back to me on it, strangely enough.  I might have to send them a reminder at this rate...

I'm sure someone will get around to doing Yatagaryu eventually.  Of course, we need to start posting the other analyses again too...
I got your analysis, Dragon ,its just that I've been busy and distracted by my life to have anytime to right up a detailed review of it. From what I remember, you did a wonderful job on it, and I could not spot any glaring grammatical errors (unlike my own). I am thinking about writing up an Anaylsis on the Pure Steel type Pokémon along with Winotinger, since I have good ideas for both right now. Whoever does Yat. has to keep in mind that what ever set it uses, it will probably end up in Ubers at the rate it is going....

Oh, and while Expunge has been nerf, it can still Sketch Atomic Slash or, if you tricky enough, Uranye unobtainable move Atomic Punch. It can also do tons of things with Baton Passing or Status, and Fire Blast+Earthquake eats everything alive regaurdless. Its still a thread, just one that has to be planned a little more differently.
Fair enough for Raffiti.  Those moves are definitely scary enough on their own as well.

And thanks for the quick response here for my Archilles analysis.  Helps me know I did a decent job with it.  Still looking forward to any changes you might suggest if you have any to provide.  Otherwise, I'm probably just going to post it fairly soon due to the drought (unintentional pun, I swear) of analyses lately.

And I totally understand the life getting busier part.  Got my first job recently so I'd have some cash flow for something later, and it's been eating my time like nothing ever has before.  It's easy to forget everything I wanted to do originally after a long day working.
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#6
Enough said, my fellow guide maker. I'll look through your guide again soon, and see if I have anything more to say about the matter (and see if I missed any spelling error).
Like the wind, I come and go as I please... but I am always there to provide a comforting breeze.

Member of Team PUNishment. Pun-pare for Struggle, make it Double Team!

Heart Phantom is my OTP~ Heart

Online ID: 000650
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#7
Yatagaryu imo isnt really that hard to write a showcase about, since its movesets are pretty direct.

Since i'm still busy irl (from finals approaching me, mind you, I will write one and update the rest before I do leave for the finals..) I can just name you the stuffs you can mingle with Yatagaryu.

[1] Yatagaryu is extremely painful and destructive foe, so Life Orb/Leftovers/Expert Belt/Choice Scarf/Choice Specs is a great item for it.

[2] Yatagaryu is extremely frail but outspeeds pretty much everything (barring Alpico, another amazing mon). Making use of this fact, it is one of the best sweepers out there with access to STAB Thunder, Draco Meteor, Dragon Pulse, etc and a decent enough coverage move like Focus Blast, Shadow Ball, Air Slash, and Hurricane (which is ewww with its ability, Hurricane doesnt get 100% acc. under Thunderstorm weather). It can also sustain itself from further damage with moves like Magnet Rise (which cripples opposing fast Ground Pokemon or Choice'd Pokemon, making their switch-in useless) and Roost. And what Special Sweeper doesn't benefit from Stat-boosting moves like Nasty Plot or Calm Mind? Yatagaryu has the best of both worlds; it learns both of these moves via level up and TM respectively. Oh, and if you think your coverage is still lacking, Hidden Power anything is not to be underestimated with 120 base Sp. Att.

[3] Yatagaryu has an amazing typing, making it one hell of a great offensive Pokemon. In fact, its stat distribution is so skewed to raw speed and damage, allowing it to be Hyper Offensive. Yatagaryu crushes teams with a simple Nasty Plot and outright sweeping almost everything afterwards. Plus, with access to Magnet Rise and pretty much all the coverage it can really ask for, a good player and Yatagaryu can make it a little too hard for good reasons for people to switch in Checks and Counters safely against one (yatagaryu only has like... 4 counters.... anyways......... yeah.......... and they still can die to it.................) Because of this, Yatagaryu is likely banned to Ubers when the Tierings are established from metagaming (SOON [TM])

[4] Yes, I mentioned about "Counters", so I will do the honour and list said Yatagaryu's "counter" here.

(1)Specially invested Metalynx is amazing. Idk how can people say this is unviable or just not a common spread, but it can tank in stuffs like Hidden Power Fire from both Mega Syrentide and Yatagaryu as well. Both Thunder and its STAB Dragon moves 3HKO's Specially invested Metalynx at best, and we aren't even counting on Mega Metalynx! Also, Focus Blast can't OHKO Specially invested Metalynx, but the same Metalynx with no Attack EVs or Att+ Nature can OHKO Yatagaryu with Earthquake, and is able to recover effectively from Leech Seed or Synthesis.

(2)Tracton can also act as a counter against Yatagaryu. Resisting both Thunder and STAB Dragon as well, Tracton just needs to watch out for other moves Yatagaryu can make use of as mentioned above. If your Tracton has Speed Boost, send it out, Protect, and proceed to outspeed Yatagaryu the very next turn. It can utilize STAB Dragon Claw and/or Draco Meteor to OHKO Yatagaryu and proceed to sweep your opponents from there. If it has Motor Drive instead, switch out your Pokemon as soon as you see an opponent Yatagaryu (preferably bait it to use Thunder on your ally Pokemon that is weak to Electric for an example) and send into Tracton. The later between the two abilities is really niche as a Yatagaryu counter, but it has the benefits of being able to sweep immediately the turn after being sent into a baited Thunder, as it gets an immediate speed boost from that turn if Yatagaryu hits it with Thunder, allowing you to outspeed and sweep from there.

(3) If you have read my showcase about Escartress, then you will realize that it too can counter Yatagaryu. Null against its signature Thunder and gets 3HKO from anything else aside HP Grass from Yatagaryu, it can hit back using Earthpower or Ice Beam. It's super slow, but just like Metalynx it can recover effectively from Recover.

(4) Specially invested Luxelong meanwhile is Null against Dragon and is resistant against Thunder and OHKO with STAB Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse/Moonblast. Despite its great typing however, it does receive more damage overall compared to Escartress and Metalynx under the same situation, but it is one of the best, most versatile Wall/Tank out there in this game. Early set up of Calm Mind will make Yatagaryu unable to dent Luxelong, but the same can't be said when its vice versa. Oh, and it can recover under the Guise of Moonlight and Wish too :p

[5] If you are wondering this: "Yatagaryu is soooooo good! Why make it on high suspect list and very possibly ban it to Ubers?", its because all of its "counters" stated above can be countered very easily from a smart Yatagaryu play, which means that they are more accurately labelled as Checks, rather than Counters. And mind you, these 4 "counters" are already the best counters out there in this game, which means even if you brainstorm a whole load, nothing comes close to anything as good as these four stated, barring Choice Scarf'd Pokemon (like Laissure and Nucleon for an example, but those still gets OHKO against a Choice Scarf'd Yatagaryu as well). Why and how are they just merely checks in the end?

Here are the examples:
(1) As i mentioned earlier, smart plays will crippled our dear 'counters' from just using a Yatagaryu well alone. Yeap. No real need for Teammate support or hazard setups to make Yatagaryu a fearsome foe to all (but when that happens, it just gurantees the game...). For an example, opting for Focus Blast on a predicted switch for an example will cripple Metalynx and OHKO Tracton, and Metalynx will die the next turn against Yatagaryu if Focus Blast hits the turn it was switched in. In another instance, switching out Yatagaryu immediately after sending it out to pressure your opponents and bait a out a predicted switch allows the good player to counteract with this forced switch as well. For an example, switching Yatagaryu out to S51-A against a predicted opponent's Luxelong switch or Laissure switch to deal with the opponents is very possible. S51-A has the upper advantage as Luxelong can't do a dent against it, while Laissure can't hit the alien with Earthquake and likes thanks to its ability, Levitate. S51-A meanwhile has the means to deal against them effectively though.

(2) Just giving Yatagaryu one free turn as you switch out to our "counters" allows Yatagaryu to set up Nasty Plot for free, and our poor counters doesn't have the proness to take in 3HKOs from that point onwards. And we're not counting in the fact that Yatagaryu runs Life Orb pretty much everytime, which means it deals an additional 1.5x damage with sharply boosted Sp. Att. Yeah. It's not a good day to face a Yatagaryu when that happens.


So yea, this comment i thought i wanted to make it short turns out to be this lengthy instead. If anyone plans to make said Yatagaryu showcase and wants to use the stuffs i stated here, it would be greatly appreciated if I am credited for this. I don't like people going around stealing people's ideas and then claiming it as their own....

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#8
(10-26-2016, 07:58 AM)Reeveelution Wrote: Yatagaryu imo isnt really that hard to write a showcase about, since its movesets are pretty direct.

Since i'm still busy irl (from finals approaching me, mind you, I will write one and update the rest before I do leave for the finals..) I can just name you the stuffs you can mingle with Yatagaryu.

[1] Yatagaryu is extremely painful and destructive foe, so Life Orb/Leftovers/Expert Belt/Choice Scarf/Choice Specs is a great item for it.

[2] Yatagaryu is extremely frail but outspeeds pretty much everything (barring Alpico, another amazing mon). Making use of this fact, it is one of the best sweepers out there with access to STAB Thunder, Draco Meteor, Dragon Pulse, etc and a decent enough coverage move like Focus Blast, Shadow Ball, Air Slash, and Hurricane (which is ewww with its ability, Hurricane doesnt get 100% acc. under Thunderstorm weather). It can also sustain itself from further damage with moves like Magnet Rise (which cripples opposing fast Ground Pokemon or Choice'd Pokemon, making their switch-in useless) and Roost. And what Special Sweeper doesn't benefit from Stat-boosting moves like Nasty Plot or Calm Mind? Yatagaryu has the best of both worlds; it learns both of these moves via level up and TM respectively. Oh, and if you think your coverage is still lacking, Hidden Power anything is not to be underestimated with 120 base Sp. Att.

[3] Yatagaryu has an amazing typing, making it one hell of a great offensive Pokemon. In fact, its stat distribution is so skewed to raw speed and damage, allowing it to be Hyper Offensive. Yatagaryu crushes teams with a simple Nasty Plot and outright sweeping almost everything afterwards. Plus, with access to Magnet Rise and pretty much all the coverage it can really ask for, a good player and Yatagaryu can make it a little too hard for good reasons for people to switch in Checks and Counters safely against one (yatagaryu only has like... 4 counters.... anyways......... yeah.......... and they still can die to it.................) Because of this, Yatagaryu is likely banned to Ubers when the Tierings are established from metagaming (SOON [TM])

[4] Yes, I mentioned about "Counters", so I will do the honour and list said Yatagaryu's "counter" here.

(1)Specially invested Metalynx is amazing. Idk how can people say this is unviable or just not a common spread, but it can tank in stuffs like Hidden Power Fire from both Mega Syrentide and Yatagaryu as well. Both Thunder and its STAB Dragon moves 3HKO's Specially invested Metalynx at best, and we aren't even counting on Mega Metalynx! Also, Focus Blast can't OHKO Specially invested Metalynx, but the same Metalynx with no Attack EVs or Att+ Nature can OHKO Yatagaryu with Earthquake, and is able to recover effectively from Leech Seed or Synthesis.

(2)Tracton can also act as a counter against Yatagaryu. Resisting both Thunder and STAB Dragon as well, Tracton just needs to watch out for other moves Yatagaryu can make use of as mentioned above. If your Tracton has Speed Boost, send it out, Protect, and proceed to outspeed Yatagaryu the very next turn. It can utilize STAB Dragon Claw and/or Draco Meteor to OHKO Yatagaryu and proceed to sweep your opponents from there. If it has Motor Drive instead, switch out your Pokemon as soon as you see an opponent Yatagaryu (preferably bait it to use Thunder on your ally Pokemon that is weak to Electric for an example) and send into Tracton. The later between the two abilities is really niche as a Yatagaryu counter, but it has the benefits of being able to sweep immediately the turn after being sent into a baited Thunder, as it gets an immediate speed boost from that turn if Yatagaryu hits it with Thunder, allowing you to outspeed and sweep from there.

(3) If you have read my showcase about Escartress, then you will realize that it too can counter Yatagaryu. Null against its signature Thunder and gets 3HKO from anything else aside HP Grass from Yatagaryu, it can hit back using Earthpower or Ice Beam. It's super slow, but just like Metalynx it can recover effectively from Recover.

(4) Specially invested Luxelong meanwhile is Null against Dragon and is resistant against Thunder and OHKO with STAB Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse/Moonblast. Despite its great typing however, it does receive more damage overall compared to Escartress and Metalynx under the same situation, but it is one of the best, most versatile Wall/Tank out there in this game. Early set up of Calm Mind will make Yatagaryu unable to dent Luxelong, but the same can't be said when its vice versa. Oh, and it can recover under the Guise of Moonlight and Wish too :p

[5] If you are wondering this: "Yatagaryu is soooooo good! Why make it on high suspect list and very possibly ban it to Ubers?", its because all of its "counters" stated above can be countered very easily from a smart Yatagaryu play, which means that they are more accurately labelled as Checks, rather than Counters. And mind you, these 4 "counters" are already the best counters out there in this game, which means even if you brainstorm a whole load, nothing comes close to anything as good as these four stated, barring Choice Scarf'd Pokemon (like Laissure and Nucleon for an example, but those still gets OHKO against a Choice Scarf'd Yatagaryu as well). Why and how are they just merely checks in the end?

Here are the examples:
(1) As i mentioned earlier, smart plays will crippled our dear 'counters' from just using a Yatagaryu well alone. Yeap.  No real need for Teammate support or hazard setups to make Yatagaryu a fearsome foe to all (but when that happens, it just gurantees the game...). For an example, opting for Focus Blast on a predicted switch for an example will cripple Metalynx and OHKO Tracton, and Metalynx will die the next turn against Yatagaryu if Focus Blast hits the turn it was switched in. In another instance, switching out Yatagaryu immediately after sending it out to pressure your opponents and bait a out a predicted switch allows the good player to counteract with this forced switch as well. For an example, switching Yatagaryu out to S51-A against a predicted opponent's Luxelong switch or Laissure switch to deal with the opponents is very possible. S51-A has the upper advantage as Luxelong can't do a dent against it, while Laissure can't hit the alien with Earthquake and likes thanks to its ability, Levitate. S51-A meanwhile has the means to deal against them effectively though.

(2) Just giving Yatagaryu one free turn as you switch out to our "counters" allows Yatagaryu to set up Nasty Plot for free, and our poor counters doesn't have the proness to take in 3HKOs from that point onwards. And we're not counting in the fact that Yatagaryu runs Life Orb pretty much everytime, which means it deals an additional 1.5x damage with sharply boosted Sp. Att. Yeah. It's not a good day to face a Yatagaryu when that happens.


So yea, this comment i thought i wanted to make it short turns out to be this lengthy instead. If anyone plans to make said Yatagaryu showcase and wants to use the stuffs i stated here, it would be greatly appreciated if I am credited for this. I don't like people going around stealing people's ideas and then claiming it as their own....

Okay I have to reply to this as the guy who's been playing competitive pokemon for the last 8 years or so. There is an argument to be made for Yatagaryu's brokenness, but it isn't the one you've made. You are, I think, the third person I've seen on this site to use the argument of

"If [pokemon] has all of its checks and counters removed, then it can freely sweep and win the game."

Once again, as the guy who's played competitive since gen 4, this argument can theoretically be used for EVERY sweeper in all of existence. This is not being broken, this is strategy. Every sweeper ever made, when its counters are eliminate, will proceed to sweep and try to win the game. That is almost the literal definition of what a sweeper is supposed to be. Trying to ban Yatagaryu on these grounds means we'd have to, as an example, ban Tracton and Wintoger because once thier counters are gone, they can theoretically win the game too.

Additionally I don't like your pessimistic outlook of yourself: "All a [pokemon] player has to do is make smart plays to avoid it getting killed / crippled.". This implies you can't do the same thing yourself. That you, for instance, cannot make double switches, predict moves and switches, or use crippling status at the correct time. 

Now, as stated, there are better arguments for Yatagaryu's ban. It's power combined with its ability make it exceedingly difficult to counter, as you've mentioned. However, it may be that prediction is key to thwarting this mon (There are innumerable pokemon immune to either one of its STAB's ) or it may be its power is too great for prediction. Its small but key movepool is another concern, allowing it to potentially thwart its counters. 

I personally wouldn't reccomend a choice item on it- due to the aforementioned STAB's, all it takes is prediction or waiting until something gets killed, then proceed to throw in a ground or fairy type on a locked move, then get a free turn to do whatever you want. The power may be worth it, but all I forsee is how easily it can be countered when locked into a move. Life orb, IMO, is much more dangerous and banworthy. 

Also I would like to reccomend specially defensive Lanthan as a counter / check. Yes Lanthan may be banned too, but it isn't banned yet and I don't count my chickens before they hatch. If and until it is banned, Lanthan is probably the best Yatagaryu check / Xounter there is- Ot takes pittiance from everything except Focus Blast, meaning it can switch in on most of its moves and proceed to OHKO with Subduction or Earthquake.
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#9
It should be noted that Laissure could also check/counter it as well. It can take at least one hit from Focus Blast (which has a chance to miss), is immune to its Main STAB, and can outspeed it with a Choice Scarf/Maz Spd EV's. If it decides to switch out instead of fighting, you can just set up Stealth Rocks to punish future switch ins, or predict the switch and smash to counter that suppose to come in. That, and if your running Moxie with it, can proceed to counter sweep in turn. Relys on good prediction, but Laissure is no joke.
Like the wind, I come and go as I please... but I am always there to provide a comforting breeze.

Member of Team PUNishment. Pun-pare for Struggle, make it Double Team!

Heart Phantom is my OTP~ Heart

Online ID: 000650
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#10
these two comments above is why i say Choice Scarf Yata can be a thing. Alpico and anything Choice Scarf'd can be dealt with using Yatagaryu and hazards setup to thin their HP down for some good Draco Meteor Spamming. Also @Catalytic , im just giving an instance of what can happen, though in battle what will happen will either end very quickly or just end up in a series of switches after switches after switches, which i'll be honest; doesn't make the game very fun at all when you have a single battle lasting 70+ turns or more. Been there, done that. It makes me writhe in pain... QAQ

Meanwhile, I don't mean to get you triggered, but what i was trying to emphasize here is how unpredictable it is to check and counter Yatagaryu, and how it in return can effectively get rid of its checks and counters by really just changing its items, or by having a niche move that can make it harder to check and counter. Really. For an example, Yatagaryu gets Magnet Rise, which it can use before the opponent switches in a Ground-type user such as Laissure and Gliscor and other Choice Scarf'd mon that can use EQ like Baariette for an instance, just for an example. Yatagaryu can also run Choice Scarf to outspeed Alpico, which is the only Pokemon that naturally outspeeds Yatagaryu at base 132 speed; and once again, same goes with Choice'd anything like Laissure.

I'm not trying to say your argument is futile (though imo in the end, it can be because of how hard it is to check for Yatagaryu's movesets and items with hopes of not losing at least 1 of your party Pokemon before you can even counteract to it) but Yatagaryu exists in the right place and time to have many of its checks and counters effectively removed thanks to the somewhat limited Pokemon variety we have here in the game. Yes, its overall movepool is really lackluster, but yes, it has all it needs for the game.

P.S. @Catalytic, I don't mean to be that pessimistic, and if you didnt know me enough I wasn't one of the few people that wants Yata quickbanned. If anything I'm just sharing my views of how powerful and hard to check a Yatagaryu can be. As much as I have really, really mixed feelings about how sweeping is a... 'skill'... when you really just need some set up and and almost blatantly spam the right moves against the right opponents, I don't think I'm that pessimistic to degrade others of my opinions on Yatagaryu, or write a long comment about it to the point that you think that I am degrading myself. It is just.... nope. Just no. I just have some doubts and confusion here and there about how and why you can say such a stuff to another aged but retired competitive player like myself, if anything.

EDIT: At any rate, I have no qualms against Lanthan as a check and solid counter for Yatagaryu; just caution for Yatagaryu's Magnet Rise. Anyways, imo the runner up behind Lanthan as a check and counter against Yatagaryu is Escartress. Magnet Rise is a trivial matter to Escartress which can come with Ice Beam, and if Escartress has already decently set up stuffs like Stockpile (which im breeding on now yayyy), Yatagaryu can't do enough to take it down
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