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+--- Thread: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok (/showthread.php?tid=918)
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - Lord Windos - 05-31-2017
(05-31-2017, 04:25 PM)shademonkey Wrote: Fun fact : Nucleon can tank a Pursuit if it doesn't switch out.
252 Atk Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Vanilluxe: 80-96 (54.4 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
And retaliate with a lethal Hyper Voice.
And Sucker Punch only kills on a roll
252 Atk Scizor Steel Wing vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Vanilluxe: 138-164 (93.8 - 111.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
God is this thing annoying.
What. the. hell. Were those calculated with or without a Coil boost, though? That could change things, at the very least! A Sub Set also has a chance at downing it, presuming that it switches into M-Arbok while it has it up, and uses either Gunk Shot or Sucker Punch...
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - shademonkey - 06-01-2017
Without a Coil boost. Arbok cannot set up on Nucleon. And if Nucleon is sent in when the snake is already on the field (with or without a boost), Petrify does not activate a second time.
And Hyper Voice bypasses subs.
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - Spiritmon - 06-02-2017
Aww one of my favourite M-Pokemon ever in Uranium. That was the Pokemon I use in my first play in Uranium. The desigh, Typing and stats its awesome. Great guide old friend :3
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - PhantomUnderYourDesk - 06-03-2017
(06-01-2017, 06:23 AM)shademonkey Wrote: And Hyper Voice bypasses subs.
I didn't know that before. But Bulbapedia indeed states that "Substitute no longer protects against this move" from Generation 6 onward. Good to know on a HyperVoice-Sylveon. Thanks for sharing!
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - Dragonstrike - 06-05-2017
(06-03-2017, 07:19 AM)PhantomUnderYourDesk Wrote:(06-01-2017, 06:23 AM)shademonkey Wrote: And Hyper Voice bypasses subs.
I didn't know that before. But Bulbapedia indeed states that "Substitute no longer protects against this move" from Generation 6 onward. Good to know on a HyperVoice-Sylveon. Thanks for sharing!
Yup! A decoy doll isn't going to do much to protect your from a sound based attack, now, is it?
Yeah, Nucleon is just really stupidly OP for many reasons...
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - Lord Windos - 06-05-2017
(06-05-2017, 11:31 AM)Dragonstrike Wrote:(06-03-2017, 07:19 AM)PhantomUnderYourDesk Wrote:(06-01-2017, 06:23 AM)shademonkey Wrote: And Hyper Voice bypasses subs.
I didn't know that before. But Bulbapedia indeed states that "Substitute no longer protects against this move" from Generation 6 onward. Good to know on a HyperVoice-Sylveon. Thanks for sharing!
Yup! A decoy doll isn't going to do much to protect your from a sound based attack, now, is it?
Yeah, Nucleon is just really stupidly OP for many reasons...
The only way I can see M-Arbok can take Nucleon is if they got a Boost from Coil and their were Stealth Rocks on the field when Nucleon switches in. It uses Sucker Punch, and Nucleon dies, but other than that Nucleon needs chip damage for this snakes move to OHKO it. Why does sound go through sub again, and who's idea was it? Sub is supposed to always take a hit before the user, or what's the point of setting it up in the first place?
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - Dragonstrike - 06-05-2017
(06-05-2017, 11:40 AM)Lord Windos Wrote:(06-05-2017, 11:31 AM)Dragonstrike Wrote:(06-03-2017, 07:19 AM)PhantomUnderYourDesk Wrote:(06-01-2017, 06:23 AM)shademonkey Wrote: And Hyper Voice bypasses subs.
I didn't know that before. But Bulbapedia indeed states that "Substitute no longer protects against this move" from Generation 6 onward. Good to know on a HyperVoice-Sylveon. Thanks for sharing!
Yup! A decoy doll isn't going to do much to protect your from a sound based attack, now, is it?
Yeah, Nucleon is just really stupidly OP for many reasons...
The only way I can see M-Arbok can take Nucleon is if they got a Boost from Coil and their were Stealth Rocks on the field when Nucleon switches in. It uses Sucker Punch, and Nucleon dies, but other than that Nucleon needs chip damage for this snakes move to OHKO it. Why does sound go through sub again, and who's idea was it? Sub is supposed to always take a hit before the user, or what's the point of setting it up in the first place?
Sound goes through Sub because Nintendo and Game Freak said so starting in gen 6. A doll sitting on the ground won't do much to protect ears. It makes sense.
Infiltrator and sound based moves are ways the main series games made Subs a little less powerful. The move still does its job, but you have to be just a little more careful with it.
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - Lord Windos - 06-05-2017
It makes it less powerful, yes, but I don't think sub was broken enough like Baton Pass to be nerfed in such a way. Logically, sound based moves getting past it make sense, but mechanically it more or less invalidates Substitute's purpose in the first place, which doesn't make much sense at all. I'm fine with Infiltrator getting past sub, since its an ability that makes ALL moves get past it, and not just a sub-sub category of them. Plus, it requires the Pokémon to sacrifice another usefull ability to just counter Sub users, which is fair play in my book.
Its not a big issue usually, but in cases like Nucleon it highlights how ridiculous the new mechanic to Subs is. Oy viee......
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - shademonkey - 06-05-2017
(06-05-2017, 11:53 AM)Lord Windos Wrote: It makes it less powerful, yes, but I don't think sub was broken enough like Baton Pass to be nerfed in such a way. Logically, sound based moves getting past it make sense, but mechanically it more or less invalidates Substitute's purpose in the first place, which doesn't make much sense at all. I'm fine with Infiltrator getting past sub, since its an ability that makes ALL moves get past it, and not just a sub-sub category of them. Plus, it requires the Pokémon to sacrifice another usefull ability to just counter Sub users, which is fair play in my book.
Its not a big issue usually, but in cases like Nucleon it highlights how ridiculous the new mechanic to Subs is. Oy viee......
How was Baton Pass nerfed again? Or maybe you're referring to the recent ban on the move that smogon decided for Showdown
RE: Competitive Guide: M-Arbok - Lord Windos - 06-05-2017
(06-05-2017, 04:28 PM)shademonkey Wrote:(06-05-2017, 11:53 AM)Lord Windos Wrote: It makes it less powerful, yes, but I don't think sub was broken enough like Baton Pass to be nerfed in such a way. Logically, sound based moves getting past it make sense, but mechanically it more or less invalidates Substitute's purpose in the first place, which doesn't make much sense at all. I'm fine with Infiltrator getting past sub, since its an ability that makes ALL moves get past it, and not just a sub-sub category of them. Plus, it requires the Pokémon to sacrifice another usefull ability to just counter Sub users, which is fair play in my book.
Its not a big issue usually, but in cases like Nucleon it highlights how ridiculous the new mechanic to Subs is. Oy viee......
How was Baton Pass nerfed again? Or maybe you're referring to the recent ban on the move that smogon decided for Showdown
Smogen nerf/bann. I play a lot of Showdown occasionaly, so that factored into my comment. Sorry for the confusion!